In this episode of the Mr. Beacon Podcast, we’re talking sustainable aquaculture, seafood traceability, and cutting-edge supply chain technology with Donna Lanzetta, the CEO and Founder of Manna Fish Farms, Manna Seafood Blockchain, and owner of A Lotta Lobster restaurant in Southampton, New York.
Donna shares her extraordinary journey from legal professional to pioneering entrepreneur in offshore fish farming. She discusses her mission to sustainably feed the world by developing fish farms in U.S. federal waters—something that currently doesn't exist at scale. Her farms are not only designed for minimal environmental impact but are also at the forefront of transparency and innovation, leveraging blockchain technology to track seafood from ocean to plate.
You’ll hear how Manna Seafood Blockchain is providing restaurants, distributors, and even oyster farmers with tools like temperature tracking, species authentication, carbon footprint measurement, and QR-code-driven provenance storytelling. Donna also outlines her vision for an Aquaculture Innovation Center that fuses education, sustainability, and community engagement—all while highlighting how small businesses can lead the way in ambient IoT adoption.
If you're curious about the future of food, ocean farming, or how digital product passports could transform what ends up on your plate, this episode is a must-listen.
Donna’s Top 3 Favorite Songs:
Mister Beacon is hosted by Steve Statler, CEO of AmbAI Inc. — creators of AmbAI, the AI agent that connects people to products and the brands behind them. AmbAI also advises leading brands on Ambient Intelligence strategy.
TRANSCRIPT
Welcome to the Mr. Beacon podcast. My name's Steve Statler, and this week we're going to be talking to Donna Lanzetta, who is the CEO of multiple businesses. She runs a fish farm. She also runs a blockchain middleware track and trace company. She owns a restaurant as well. So this is a super interesting perspective. A lot of the things that really excite me about the space we cover in this podcast is the view we have of what's going to come in the future. And a really important aspect of that is end to end visibility.
{ 0:45 }
And Donna is an entrepreneur who's making end to end visibility happening because she owns the upstream fish farm, the downstream restaurant and the the business that can provide the connectivity between those two. So that this future that so many of us are working towards, where consumers can understand so much more about where the food and clothing and other products have come from that they're buying and also how they've been treated on the way. And a future where manufacturers can connect directly with consumers and potentially make huge savings, reduce massive reductions in the cost of goods and in carbon. When you can do that, it's really exciting. And I think one of the places where we're going to see this end to end connectivity happen is in smaller businesses.
{ 1:47 }
I think the wine trade is another one where I know that there are businesses that are working on putting ambient technology onto cases of wine and initially going downstream a little bit, but ultimately down to the consumer. So it's an exciting time in ambient IoT and that's underscored by the fact that ABI Research have published another report on ambient IoT. This one has got a a volume forecast, which is always good numbers make the world go round and their forecast is 1.1 billion ambient IoT devices by 20-30. Now of course, we have no idea whether this will come to come to fruition. I guess the one thing we know is it's going to be wrong. It'll probably either be a little optimistic or a little pessimistic, but I think it's a reasonable guess. I personally believe it's on the conservative side.
{ 2:51 }
I know of at least three customers that are using ambient IoT for coarse grain tracking of things who have plans in the next two years. So 2027 to get to roughly that number as they go down to case level tracking in, in retail and returns tracking in online commerce and parcel tracking in in the postal space. So, but who knows, it'll be exciting to to see that roll out. So if you want to stay in touch with what's happening and connect directly with me, I would love to meet you. I'm going to be attending at least three events between now and the end of the year. I'm speaking at them. The first one is called Tech Blick Future of Electronics. It's going to be in Boston, June the 11th and 12th, and I'm going to be talking about connecting artificial intelligence and ambient IoT, this new field of ambient intelligence.
{ 3:58 }
So looking forward to to that. And then later that month, June 23rd, 24th, I'm going to be in Amsterdam AIPIA, which is the Active Intelligent Packaging Industry Association. And I'm going to be on a panel talking about digital product passports. It's the opening panel. It's sponsored by our friends at Identive. So thanks to the folks at Identive for inviting not just me, but we have representatives from St. Micro who make chips that go into NFC tags. We've got the leader of the NFC forum who's going to be there, Thomas Roding, who is the vice chair of JTC 24, the standards group that's working on digital product passports. He's also the CEO of Naravero, always have a problem saying that, but they're a digital product Passport as a service company over in Europe.
{ 5:00 }
I'm going to be really interested to meet him. He's really got his finger on the pulse of what's happening. And an old friend and colleague of mine, Vinu Gitlopali, who's the CEO of another San Diego based company, Tag and Track, he's going to be on the panel as well. So that's that. And then the last event in November, November, the 4th and the 6th is going to be Embedded World North America, and that's going to be in Anaheim, just north of where I live here in California. And the Ambient IoT Alliance has got two hours on the agenda. There's going to be 3 presentations, a panel. We'll see who's actually going to be presenting what definitely going to be there, because it's pretty much on my doorstep. And our hope is to get one of the customers to who's actually using ambient IoT to talk.
{ 5:59 }
And the alliance is actually working on some really interesting white papers, one which is a summary of all of the standards activity that's going on across Bluetooth, Wi-Fi and cellular. And so I'm hoping that that is going to be at least one of the presentations. And there's another one on ROI and use cases. So I'm, I'm lobbying for both of those to be represented, but we'll see. I'll as, as we learn more about that, I'll share details here. And lastly, before we get to Donna, I just wanted to tell you a bit about what we're doing at my new company, Ambi, which is spelled Ambi as an ambient. And then AI. We've got a You Gov survey which we're going to be publishing in the next month.
{ 6:48 }
It's about expiry dates, which is one of the things that's going to change drastically as we get intelligence in the supply chain, we can make expiry dates a lot more accurate. And it turns out according to the survey, people really want that. So this is one thing that we're working on. They're also working on an Ambient IoT report, which is going to be a really substantial report on the standards, the scenarios for the rollout of Ambient IoT, the vendors that are out there. And the last thing is as a company, we're we're focusing on brands. So we're focusing on and looking for brands that are interested in direct connections with their customers using AI, using Ambient IoT and using this AI assistant that we're developing here at AMBI. So that's what we're doing in the company. Those are the events that are happening.
{ 7:52 }
Interesting research, but here what you probably came for is my conversation with Donna Lanzetta, CEO of multiple companies doing end to end track and and trace in the seafood market. Enjoy it. So Mr. Beacon Ambient IoT Podcast is sponsored by Williot, bringing intelligence to every single thing. Donna, thanks so much for coming on the podcast. It's really great to have you on the show.
Speaker 2: { 8:29 }
It's great to be here, Steve. Thanks for having me. I love to speak about aquaculture so.
Speaker 1: { 8:34 }
Yes. And I was just thinking about my questions to you and everything that you've done. And you've done a lot of things over the years. I was going through your web history, but in terms of aquaculture and seafood traceability, ethical sourcing, you've got that problem surrounded you.
{ 8:58 }
You've got the restaurant, you've got the, the production, the, the fish farm and you've got the, the technology company. So you've got kind of the the beginning and the middle and the end. What are the problems that you're trying to solve? You're putting, I think you're taking a very holistic approach and I'm very interested in what's motivating you to do all of these things.
Speaker 2: { 9:24 }
Well, it's a tapestry. So really we started with Mana fish farms in order to feed the world, right? To be able to grow protein in the ocean in federal water, and to be able to do it differently without impact on the environment. And to track and trace and prove what we're doing so that we can prove with science the efficiency of ocean farming.
{ 9:52 }
And also the opportunity to have a 0 carbon footprint theoretically with not using any natural resources and having a responsible sustainable behavior at sea. That was just really the beginning of the journey is starting on these permits. And we have the two offshore farms that we're permitting now full application in, in the Gulf for a site 23 miles off of Pensacola where we'll have 12 submerged net pens.
Speaker 1: { 10:23 }
So this is Manor Fish Farms and Manor. You know, I have to confess, I'm not a regular churchgoer, but I grew up in England where the church and the school there, they're actually intertwined. There's no separation of church and state. It's, it's really the opposite. So manna, you know, it's, it's kind of the, the Hebrew God creating food for the Israelites as they're lost in the desert, right. That's that was the thing.
{ 10:52 }
And I guess I was really surprised as I looked at some of your websites that there are huge problems with food production, even seafood production. Is that not the case?
Speaker 2: { 11:04 }
Well, you know, in the US we're importing 91% of our seafood, so and we're doing quite a bit now in land base in the US and that's great. Of course land base uses water and land and natural resources where the, you know, the opportunity to grow in the ocean and not use those resources. Of course, we'll use other resources because we need to use fuel to get back and forth, but we're looking at electric vessels. You know, we're looking at ways to do it differently so that we don't have that great impact. And I think it can be done. In the US, there are no federal water fin fish farms, and we do have a state water farm that's very successful. Blue ocean mariculture in Hawaii is growing Kampachi in state waters. Beautiful.
Speaker 1: { 11:57 }
What's Kampachi?
Speaker 2: { 11:59 }
Kampachi. It's like a yellowtail.
Speaker 1: { 12:01 }
Oh, OK. All right.
Speaker 2: { 12:03 }
So it's a delicious fish.
Speaker 1: { 12:05 }
OK. And and that's, so I'm not clear on what this distinction is between what you're doing, which is sounds like it's a very slow process in terms of getting all of the permits that are required. But you're, you're literally you have pens out close to shore where the fish are cultivated. What's how is that different to what's going on in Hawaii? You're.
Speaker 2: { 12:29 }
In Hawaii, they're near to shore because they can get the depth that they need very close to shore. Down in Florida, we would have to go 23 miles offshore in order to get the depth we need to use these submersible net pens. In New York, we've been doing marine spatial planning for a site off eastern Long Island that's 9 miles offshore to get that depth that we need. So it really depends where you are.
{ 12:56 }
There's about 37 federal and state agencies in the US that have to get on the same page in order to permit a farm in federal water. Right now we have no legislation or pathway, clear pathway, to show how this can be done. We are pioneering to help create that pathway and help others who will come after us understand how it can be done faster because no farm will ever be viable if they have to spend 10 years getting permits. It's impossible.
Speaker 1: { 13:29 }
Which is what you've been doing.
Speaker 2: { 13:30 }
Yeah, O yeah, it's, it's working for our own ermits, but also at the same time working to share information about how this can be streamlined in the future.
Speaker 1: { 13:44 }
So fish farming that's done onshore, you were gracious about it, but it's certainly got its critics in terms of the pollution and disease and so forth. And it's obviously constrained by size.
{ 13:59 }
Presumably if you're out at sea then a lot of those issues are mitigated.
Speaker 2: { 14:05 }
Yes, that's the whole idea to go out to sea and be able to have a 9000 cubic meter net pen underwater with let's say 250,000 lbs of fish. We'll have 12. It's a lot of fish. But if we don't introduce anything inorganic into the sea and we monitor right now we're doing very robust modeling to determine in that specific site. Well, first to select the site that we believe will be suitable for farming and have the least impact on the other ocean users and find a good spot and then to do our operations. So we have a minimal impact. We've committed to 100% transparency. So that will be interesting because everybody can watch along with us and we don't want to be mysterious about what we're doing.
{ 14:59 }
We want to be transparent. And it really was that transparency, commitment and traceability that kind of led me into the blockchain business. Because when you think about all that fish and everything coming through the supply chain and looking at the efficiency of the supply chain, it was another shock to learn that, you know, about 50% to 70% on some species are mislabeled and not actually the fish. And we're in a time right now where people want to know what they're what they're having. They don't want to have products that are illegal or you know, some type of IUU fishing, if they even know what IUU fishing is, right? So we have to educate them and what better way than through this platform that we've developed to track products through the supply chain.
Speaker 1: { 15:50 }
And and and. Can you explain what it because I don't know what it is.
Speaker 2: { 15:54 }
Well, what it is, is we've convened A blockchain network and we're on the IBM Food Trust or what used to be the IBM Food Trust. And what it does is it locks in the provenance of the product, where it was from when it was harvested. And then we add tools to the platform to help seafood users in this sense. Temperature, so we can track temperature, carbon footprint tracking so we can track that species authentication. These are important tools because if I'm going to pay for halibut, I want to know that I'm actually getting halibut and not some species that's been substituted in.
{ 16:38 }
So I think as we develop, there'll be more tools that will come in and then we have the interoperability to link into other platforms, whether it's seafood import monitoring program or FISMA and all these tariffs that are now, you know, how do we regulate, how do we ensure that the products are compliant, are actually from where they say they're from and not in fact going through 1 country to get to another country and you know, to circumvent the tariffs. So that's an interesting tool as well. And now we're also seeing, you know, some farmers. I myself am an oyster farmer. Now while I'm waiting, we've been. Oh, really? Yes. But some farmers are performing ecosystem services like oyster farmers or sequestering carbon. So we should calculate that and we need to log it in and we can bank it in a carbon sink, in a carbon bank on the same platform that's tracked products. So we'll see how all that goes. If you look into the European Union and what's happening around the world with carbon credits, et cetera, I think it's something that may come our way down the line.
Speaker 1: { 18:00 }
Yeah, I think more and more we're becoming educated into the problems that we as a species reeking over the world, the the industrialization that we've all benefited from in amazing positive ways has a cost. And it seems like, you know, in some people will just say, well, it's up to the government to kind of fix it. But I think there's another set of people that feel like they want to use their power as consumer to have agency and to drive the changes that they want to see. And, you know, ultimately change is driven by the people, isn't it? Whether it's people at the ballot box or people at the store. But you can't exercise change if you're in the dark. And, you know, when we buy foods at the moment, we are largely in the dark, aren't we?
{ 18:54 }
We the packaging doesn't permit a full audit trail of where things come from. It's minimal. And, you know, their goal is to get you to buy something and to cut the cost of the packaging And, and there's just practical limits. But now with AI, with phones, there's this opportunity, isn't there, to see, well, what am I? Am I making things worse? Am I making things better? And am I consuming something that's healthy, that's going to help my family? And, and, and so I think what you're doing is important. And I think it's fascinating that you really have this 360° view of it. And you know, I, I think I'm not sure what, what the status is of your restaurant, but I remember you and I talking about the fact that you had a restaurant and some of the challenges of informing people in that situation about what they're consuming. And maybe you want to talk a little bit about that, if you would?
Speaker 2: { 19:54 }
Yes, yes, Plug from my restaurant Mana at Lobster Inn in Southampton, NY.
{ 19:59 }
But on May 2nd we have the Seed to Soil Summit there, which is the local university having their conference at the School of Marine Science. And then after the conference, they're coming over to have dinner in the restaurant. The restaurant is actually an opportunity to link the blockchain technology into the restaurant, interoperate with our inventory system and actually have a QR code on our menu that guests will be able to scan and get accurate information. Accurate being the operative word about the products that they may be ordering. You know, we tracked, we know we're doing, we're going to do well and do the right thing with this company because it can only get better, right? We tracked a tuna from Montauk just to see Montauk, NY tuna capital of I don't know what, but so we tracked a tuna from Montauk.
{ 20:56 }
It was bought on the dock by a broker, sold to another distributor. A broker brings it to freezes it brings it to Japan, it gets frozen, sold to another broker in Japan, sells it to another distributor in Japan. Second distributor brings it back to the US. It ends up at Fulton Fish Market, gets sold to a broker and then to another distributor. That last distributor brings it back to a restaurant on Long Island that was literally 30 miles away from where it was originally caught. And they're getting it six months later. And then the fisherman's being told, sorry, Mr. Fisherman, we can't give you the full amount from the auction because somewhere along the line, they didn't chill your fish properly. And you're only getting this. And that is, it's a travesty, really, when we think about the hard work that the fishermen do and the farmers.
{ 21:48 }
This is a tool that can be used by both to make sure to ensure quality, to allow instant recalls if there's a problem and that will also reduce costs, to reduce costs of products liability insurance because of those safety features that are inherited in the in the platform. So it can only get better.
Speaker 1: { 22:08 }
If the.
Speaker 2: { 22:09 }
Thing can become more efficient. We can, you know, get more money into the pockets of the fishermen and the farmers as they're rightfully entitled to and also see where maybe there's too many middle men really sucking the juice out of the out of the industry. So fish sauce.
Speaker 1: { 22:31 }
You're right. Yeah. So you can have some efficiencies that will reduce cost and improve freshness and extend shelf life and reduce waste. And I think it's easy, certainly easy for me to get on my soapbox and get into preach mode about the real problems that exist and use guilt and a desire for fixing terrible labour conditions.
{ 22:58 }
Is is one of the things that I learnt from your, your website that exists. There's forced labour, slave labour involved in some of these supply chains and I think it's very easy for this to become a downer. But I think it's also important to paint the picture of how, you know, the enjoyment that can come if we deploy this technology. I don't know, have you if you have some thoughts on that, but I do. But I'll let you let's paint the picture of what this could be like in a world where those problems get fixed, and why people can actually be happier in this world.
Speaker 2: { 23:36 }
Yes, I think I can envision it myself around oysters, especially right here in my region in New York, we have wonderful oyster farming, wonderful wild oysters.
{ 23:49 }
So to be able to have a row of barrels with oysters and where you could go down the line and scan and say, oh look, you know, this oyster farmer is a woman or, oh look, this oyster farmer is from this particular area. And we can look at where and how and whether they're wild and farmed and, and we can engage around the oyster and have taste testings and friendly competitions between for here in eastern Long Island, we have the North Fork and the South Fork. So we're having oyster farmers on both sides in various bays so we can talk about the miwa of the oysters and where they're from and which tastes best. And I mean, it's all fun and delicious.
Speaker 1: { 24:38 }
Yeah, people can have better tasting food that they really enjoy.
{ 24:42 }
And and if I think about some of the best eating experiences I've had, it's been going to like a farmers market where you meet the person that's grown the food and you get enthusiastic about it because it's basically there's a story and, you know, mass produced food where you have no idea where it's come from. There really is no story. It's, it's sustenance for subsistence rather than, you know, we've all got a short life to live. Let's, let's, let's enjoy our food. And, you know, anyone that's been to a good restaurant and had a great waiter that's told the story of of where the wine or the food has come from knows that there's joy to be had when you understand where something has has come from. But you know, sometimes it's difficult even for a waiter to know what story to tell. I guess you run a restaurant. You've seen that yourself, right?
Speaker 2: { 25:41 }
I've seen and I've eaten at a lot of restaurants where the service have given me misinformation. They're telling me, oh, it's definitely wild when I know it's farmed because they think that's what I want to hear, but I won't hear the truth, not what I want to hear.
{ 25:59 }
And what's evolving now is also liability, Steve, liability for the restaurants that are saying they're serving local food and maybe it's been switched out and maybe it's not saying that they're serving, you know, Gulf shrimp when in fact the shrimp is from Thailand. And this happened just last summer out here with us. My distributor had a had previously paid a fine of 50,000 for illegal product and then got criminally sued for allegedly being part of a conspiracy and the conspiracy was to move illegal seafood into the marketplace and with the fishermen. And So what happened is they took a deal, testified against the fisherman, admitted they were part of a conspiracy to falsify records and books and really bring illegal product into the marketplace.
{ 26:58 }
They paid a $250,000 fine the second time and testified against the fisherman who now is in jail for three years. So this is a big problem that needs to be resolved. Now, if I bought that product into my restaurant, conceivably I could be part of that conspiracy. I don't want to be part of a conspiracy. I can be charged with part of that being part of that conspiracy. I think we're seeing chefs and restaurant owners that want to do the right thing, that make commitments to do the right thing, and then don't have the tools to do the right thing because of this seafood fraud which is rampant throughout the industry.
Speaker 1: { 27:42 }
It's interesting. I, you know, working, being on starting my own company at the moment, I'm struck by how you need to have two sides to your brain working.
{ 27:55 }
On one hand, there's a very realistic, no BS, cynical side. And then the other side is the, you know, they would call it visionary. And I'm not talking about Steve Jobs giving performance art presentations, but basically a sense in your mind about where you want to head, whether things really an optimism that things can really be better. And I mean, you were a lawyer, an attorney, a, a judge in a, in a traffic court, a New York traffic court. I'm sure you saw a huge amount of real life. And I'd, I'd love to hear some stories about that, maybe at another time. But how do you keep that duality going in your head of optimism, idealism, vision with you've seen some, you've probably seen a lot of people getting into trouble, laws broken, all that sort of thing. How do you do that?
Speaker 2: { 28:54 }
Liar, liar, pants on fire.
{ 28:56 }
That was the hardest part about being in the legal field for all those years is just flushing out the lies and.
Speaker 1: { 29:04 }
There's so much.
Speaker 2: { 29:06 }
Of it so to have when I think about flushing out the lies out of the seafood supply chain, what better tool than the blockchain? Because the blockchain provides an immutable record, can't be changed. It is what it is and that's it. And we can work with that and build on that. And that's the way I see it. You know, with the offshore. I just wanted to circle back because you asked me about the near shore and I didn't really answer you, but I think there is a place too for the near shore culture. And it's all about balance, Steve. It's about balancing production with the capacity of the environment and monitoring. Like I said, we're putting our sensors so we can determine right now with our modeling where the sensor should go.
{ 29:57 }
So we can check where the feed is going to land or likely to land and make sure we don't overfeed the fish offshore, right. You know, even with the blockchain, I look to see once we have all the data of the seafood moving, you know, how can we build more with that? Whether we can have smart contracts and maybe auction platform or a coin or one thing we're looking at is to move products through the waterway on an electric catamaran. And I'm looking to move from, you know, Huntington, NY all the way up the coast to Maine and have AI determine our supply when a, where our stops are, what we need to pick up and drop off at which locations. And that's exciting. That's totally different and new and.
Speaker 1: { 30:51 }
Yeah, innovative. We have some new tools. So let's go back to the tools.
{ 30:56 }
And you, you mentioned that you started this journey working with IBM Food Trust and my understanding is that they are retiring that offering now. So what are your plans on that front? How are you going to adapt with that reality?
Speaker 2: { 31:14 }
We've gone with a new platform that has assumed the food trust, if you will, and that's where we're starting. And what I've learned in the last six months in assuming the operators who are already on the platform is that, you know, like Norwegians are way ahead of us. That's really what I say. They were just way ahead. Not only are there, you know, 12 Norwegian salmon farms already using the platform that we can, you know, service them now as our our users, it sets a model for sustainability and really for responsibility for the future.
{ 31:54 }
And it's not only the farms, there's others that are using the platform to move other products. So, you know, we're in, we're excited for seafood, but we're looking at other items that would benefit from the platform as well, like timber or maybe baby or cannabis or who knows. This is just really the beginning. When you look at the Food Safety Modernization Act and the mandate for reporting, yes, it's been pushed back a little bit, but it's coming. It has to come, yes.
Speaker 1: { 32:31 }
Well, it's been pushed back 30 months, hasn't it? The FISMA, we've covered FISMA a couple of times without Frank Janis on the podcast. And the, the deadline was January the 20th, 2026. So just basically half a year away. And surprise, surprise, the whole industry is not ready for that. So I think it got pushed back 30 months, which seems like a long time, 2 1/2 years.
{ 32:56 }
But really it's still probably not enough time for absolutely everyone to do what needs to be done. So the urgency hasn't gone away. The government is requiring traceability because it saves lives and it also saves a lot of money because you don't want a industry decimated. So having automating traceability is clearly the way to go. Having this regulation is a driver for putting automation in that can just help you make more money as well as stay the right side of the the law. So you're working with starfish. Is that correct? Is it OK to say that? So wigs, who's who was on the show as CEO of starfish and also when he was at IBM food Trust is, is one of the the, the the actually the person that linked us together. So thank you. That's right.
{ 33:49 }
Can you talk a bit about what you're the, the Manor Seafood blockchain is going to be doing beyond the so there's there's the starfish platform. What, what, what is, what do you do to add to that and, and use it in your platform? And who are the customers that you want for the, the Manor seafood blockchain business? It's a it's you're maybe going from almost as competitors, although I guess your seafood's not really competing with with beef and and and other food food products. But who's your customer and what are you offering them?
Speaker 2: { 34:31 }
Yes. So we offer them at MANA Blockchain, these tools that we're integrating into the our system, right. They're not going to be, it's not just straight tracking and tracing. Of course there's temperature because that's been pretty much established.
{ 34:47 }
But as we go from there, to be able to have, as I said, these smart contracts and species authentication and other deliverables that will come to the users and also the ability to interoperate. And this is key. It was a missing piece for a while as we were starting because everyone has different systems, different inventory systems in the restaurants, you know, different systems in the processing plants, different systems that all need to be connected in order for this platform to be efficient. So we offer the interoperability piece as well as the specific tools per industry. I've been talking about seafood, but of course, we're looking at meat. We already have some chicken on and I think you'll see some new exciting uses of the platform over the next year. A little teaser. You'll have to have me back.
Speaker 1: { 35:46 }
Very good. We will. And so what's your approach? You know, having a vision is kind of the fun part, I guess of where you want to get to.
{ 35:56 }
And you know, the challenge is, is like the sequence of and knowing what technologies to use when and not over building too early. So how are you? How are you organizing your your go to market?
Speaker 2: { 36:13 }
Yes. So we have a huge team. We're spread out geographically in different ports and locations. We start locally to, you know, showcase the benefits of the local platform, how we can guarantee that it's actually local fish through our local markets and our local restaurants, et cetera, et cetera. And then we also because we're in Norway already on with salmon on the platform that we start on that in a more global scale to be looking at high producing fish farms that would benefit from a utilization of the platform. And we also like I said have these new uses that are coming out that'll be scaled up.
{ 36:59 }
But it's almost like a blitz scale approach to this launch. I think over the next six months we'll be seeing a lot of activity and our pilots are underway now to be able to start to use the data. And it's promoting US seafood too, like using the oysters as a pilot to be able to learn about oyster farming, calculate the sequestration of carbon, look and see who those farmers are. You know what, what made them become farmers and get it all into a little 32nd video clip that consumers can watch and say, oh, for example, peconic tonic oysters.
{ 37:46 }
2 gentlemen from Australia who just fell in love with oyster farming, who knew One lives in Queens, one lives in New Jersey, They bought a little farm out here with oysters and they now have 2,000,000 oysters in the water and it's a labor of love. So to learn about that and taste it too, that'll be fun. And I think we'll have some great activities at the at the restaurant. But right now I have 4 1/2 acres across the street from the restaurant, and I'm working hard to build a aquaculture Innovation Center on that land, integrating the restaurant and the farmland. And then the farmland would serve as a demonstration farm. So tours could come, schools could come. You could walk through the farm and see and taste the oysters and see and maybe take a boat ride out to the oyster lease and come back or go around the farm and see them farming seaweed or mushrooms or how they're making compost, how they're using the oyster shells to make oyster reefs and the whole circularity of it.
{ 38:54 }
All right, we'll have bees and honey and eggs and, you know, looking at all of that, I'm excited to then take even the seaweed and say, OK, what are we doing with the seaweed then? Oh, here we are. We have these chairs that we made out of the seaweed or, you know, look at this. And so it's a big vision, but hoping that the funding will align and I'll be able to build this aquaculture Innovation Center, which is really what I wanted to do from the beginning when I bought the restaurant in 2018, was to have it be a Mecca for seafood. A Learning Center to learn about offshore aquaculture, to learn about ropeless gear for lobster and crab farming. You know, what's that about and how can we teach and we do have a manufacturing division in mana, mana systems that will be making the equipment. So also to show these are different types of.
Speaker 1: { 39:55 }
The equipment for the oyster farming.
Speaker 2: { 39:58 }
The equipment for the oyster farming, the aquafort IMTA platforms for farming near shore and offshore and also the storm safe submersible net pens, which are the larger submersible pens we plan to use in the open ocean. So and to work with that equipment to integrate. Robotics and this new technology that rolls out every year, new tools that can be added to the equipment, whether it's automated feed or nano bubbles or different types of materials that can be used. So we can't help but look at all of that at the same time.
Speaker 1: { 40:41 }
OK.
{ 40:42 }
So that's you're really vertically integrating, but you're also opening the technology that you're developing to vertically integrate yourself and you're offering it to to others, which I think makes sense to if you're going to affect change and have a sustainable business model, then that that does make sense. And I do want to go back to the question of, well, how do people get started? But in terms of what this looks like or will look like, someone can go to your restaurant. They'll scan the QR code, they'll see the full provenance of where the produce on the, the menu, the, the, the seafood, the meats, the vegetables that come from. And they'll be a, a story that can go beyond whatever a waiter can tell them in a few, few minutes. If someone runs an oyster farm and they like the sound of what you've described beyond just getting in touch with you, what, what's the sort of process that you recommend to start to be able to implement traceability? Because it's. It's not a simple thing, is it?
Speaker 2: { 41:52 }
It's not a simple thing. I would recommend that they call me and get on the waiting list.
{ 41:58 }
We're supporting the first species into onto the platform by by covering the cost for their pilot video. But so there's an opportunity whoever the first, you know, steelhead farmer might be, we would cover that, right? So that's kind of fun in the beginning, but to get on now, they can start by integrating their farm with tools like the carbon sequestration tracker that NOAA has released. It's a free tool. All oyster farmers can use it, and it calculates the ecosystem services those oysters are performing. So just so it's already there. And when we come in, we just link it onto the platform, that kind of thing. Keeping their records. They're already tagging products. I just really get ready.
{ 42:54 }
I think that it's going to be a big movement really through the restaurants because this liability issue is really front and center with the restaurants. Inside Edition just did a an expose in New York City where they went from seafood restaurant to seafood restaurant. I think they did about 10 where they looked at the menu. They said, oh, you're, you're saying that this is this and they tested it. They sent it to the lab. Half of them were misrepresenting. And it's not necessarily the restaurants that know, but the buck is going to stop, stop with them because they're, they have the responsibility of presenting the product to the consumers. And when they say we're sourcing locally, they then have to source locally. And how do they source locally for sure? They either go and catch it themselves or they go down to the dock and make sure that it's just come in that day really, or they have to trust their distributor.
Speaker 1: { 43:56 }
Yeah, yeah. So.
Speaker 2: { 43:58 }
That becomes an issue.
Speaker 1: { 44:01 }
Yes, I, well, I commend what you're doing. I think it's the way things are going. The JTC 24 committee, which is work is basically the European Union standard for digital product passports, and that's got the weight of law behind it. So there's going to be enforcement and requirements for the European Union. That's a standard that's going to spread beyond Europe because it applies to everyone that's supplying Europe and also a lot of the countries that follow Europe through the UN and so forth. So I think this is definitely the way to go. And to me, the secret is to figure out how can you do the right thing, but also get efficiencies, save money, make money at the same time. And I think what you've outlined with telling the story behind a product which allows you to command a premium is, is certainly an important part of that.
{ 44:59 }
Well, I can't believe it. We've almost consumed all our time. But is there anything that I should have asked you that I didn't ask you about what you're doing in this space, or have we captured it?
Speaker 2: { 45:11 }
I think it's really important that everyone understand why it's so important to farm in the ocean and what the scope is of what we're proposing and what can be accomplished in such a small area. For example, we can use 110th of 1% of our exclusive economic zone, 110th of 1% and in that 110th of 1% we can grow an amount equal to the total annual wild catch, 110th of 1%, right?
Speaker 1: { 45:45 }
Yeah. So we've got huge opportunity for growth and where we may be running out of space and land and running short on inputs and all that sort of thing in other spaces, then then we've got an opportunity here.
Speaker 2: { 46:00 }
The other thing I think is really important is that fish is such an efficient protein to grow more efficient in that it can convert 1 LB of feed or 1 1/2 lbs of feed to a pound of biomass. Now, when you're farming chicken or pork or meat, that can go up to 8 to 10 lbs of feed for a pound of beef and the scales down through beef and chicken, et cetera. But I think that to be able to have that efficient biomass conversion is a big part of ocean farming. And fish are just natural convert. They're so healthy, they're so good for you.
{ 46:46 }
There's and if you feed them the right products, you know, the right feed, I don't want to say organic, but natural, you know, with some of the new compositions that are coming up between fly larvae or waste, seafood waste products that can be used. It's all about this circular economy and doing the most efficient job in bringing that biomass to the market. Fish don't it won't doesn't use any water. They're not use it. We found that we did a study and we found that we can power the farms with wave energy. So we cannot use fuel. We can look at electric vessels to bring our feed out and bring our harvest in and be more efficient in these ways. So I think when you think about the future and all the people that are going to need a protein, seafood has to be a big part of it. And that 110th of 1% is so important to understand the scope. You know, we're not looking to fill the federal waters with fish farms. It's a small footprint and it's a great production amount. And let's get going with it. US is all I could say.
{ 47:58 }
It's time overdue.
Speaker 1: { 48:00 }
I agree. So Donna, one of my favorite parts of the show is where we ask our guests for three songs that have meaning to them. What 3 songs did you choose?
Speaker 2: { 48:14 }
Well I I have to 1st thank you for the heads up on this. I wouldn't have liked being put on the spot but have thought about it and my selections are my first choice is Hallelujah by Leonard Cohen.
Speaker 1: { 48:29 }
I think.
Speaker 2: { 48:30 }
Really important to, you know, base our lives giving thanks to God. And I think it's a it's a big part of my life and my faith and really the faith that has driven the development of my company. So it's a big part for Hallelujah. I know it's kind of about love, and that's not, but for me it's about spirituality and giving thanks.
Speaker 1: { 48:59 }
Oh I'm racking my brains. I was just watching a clip on Facebook of someone being asked this question on a late night talk show and they they chose the same song. Some celebrity. It's going to come to me. But anyway, you're not alone. Other people think that's a really good song too.
Speaker 2: { 49:17 }
It is Leonard Cohen, very talented.
Speaker 1: { 49:20 }
Yeah, rest in peace. OK, good, Great start. What's song #2?
Speaker 2: { 49:26 }
So #2 is a little off the beaten track. There was an old band called Air Supply.
Speaker 1: { 49:34 }
Oh, I remember that.
Speaker 2: { 49:35 }
If you remember that you sang a song, hold your head up.
Speaker 1: { 49:40 }
Yes.
Speaker 2: { 49:41 }
I think it's really goes a long way to drive perseverance and you know, powering through, which has been a really big part for Mana in waiting for the permits and getting through all the opposition and really persevering and that's what we do.
{ 49:59 }
So air supply, hold your head up.
Speaker 1: { 50:03 }
Yeah, a lot of people have motivational songs they listened to before going into meetings, but I think the motivation that enables an entrepreneur to push through setbacks is is really appropriate, especially for this show where we're dealing with cutting edge technology and going places no person has gone before. So very good.
Speaker 2: { 50:22 }
Thank you and my my final song would is also digging deep into the barrel. It's a Carole King song from back in the day. I may remember a tapestry.
Speaker 1: { 50:35 }
Yes, amazing album.
Speaker 2: { 50:38 }
Tapestry for me is about the circular economy, but really it's about how everything is interwoven.
{ 50:45 }
And, you know, for me, that's really my life and the fact that where I am now with developing this company and all the people that I have met over the last 10 years to make it happen, we're now we have a pretty strong woven web and we're ready to lead in ocean mariculture in the US and really in supply chain technology also throughout the world. So yeah, Tapestry. Beautiful song.
Speaker 1: { 51:16 }
Yeah, I've got it in my in my record collection behind me. It is an amazing record. So I'm I'm there with you. Wonderful. Well, Donna, thanks so much for some inspiring music choices and thanks very much for appearing on the show.
Speaker 2: { 51:31 }
Thank you so much. I appreciate the opportunity, Steve. Thanks.
Speaker 1: { 51:36 }
OK. That was the the conversation with Donna. Thanks very much for sticking to the end. Your unusual and tremendously valued for for for doing that. I do want to thank Williot for their continued sponsorship of the show they make.
{ 51:53 }
They underwrite the cost of the editing, which is done by Aaron Hammock who has immense stamina and skill. So thanks to Aaron for doing that. Thanks to Sierra Walden of Williot, who is the person that helps to push out the episodes on on LinkedIn and on the the Williot website. And lastly, what have I been listening to as I've been working since we last spoke? Well, I've been going back to the world of CDs and there's a a Doctor Martin music sampler which is an amazing CD. It's probably really difficult to get. I don't know if you can listen to it online. I have been listening to it in it's CD form and it's got an interesting selection of groups. Primal Scream, a group called solo coughing DJ Cool and and a track called Ripstop, which is really, really cool. This CD is particularly interesting to me.
{ 52:55 }
It came out I think around about 1990 and it includes an EarthLink subscription for dial free 15 days of dial up Internet access. So that's really what makes me think back to those good old days when you had to buy special hardware and software and find an ISP that had lots of phone lines that could take our connections. So anyway, that's it for me. Until next time, enjoy the journey and be safe.
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